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Long before Andrew Lohse became a pariah at Dartmouth College, he was just another scarily accomplished teenager with lofty ambitions. Five feet 10 with large blue eyes and the kind of sweet-faced demeanor that always earned him a pass, he grew up in the not-quite-rural, not-quite-suburban, decidedly middle-class town of Branchburg, New Jersey, and attended a public school where he made mostly A’s, scored 2190 on his SATs and compiled an exhaustive list of extracurricular activities that included varsity lacrosse, model U.N. (he was president), National Honor Society, band, orchestra, Spanish club, debate and – on weekends – a special pre-college program at the Manhattan School of Music, where he received a degree in jazz bass.

He also wrote songs; gigged semiprofessionally at restaurants throughout New York, New Jersey and Connecticut; played drums for a rock band; chased, and conquered, numerous girls; and by his high school graduation, in 2008, had reached the pinnacle of adolescent cool by dating “this really hot skanky cheerleader,” as he puts it. This did not go over well.

At a college where two-thirds of the upperclassmen are members of Greek houses, fraternities essentially control the social life on campus. To criticize Dartmouth’s frats, which date back more than 150 years, is tantamount to criticizing Dartmouth itself, the smallest and most insular school in the Ivy League. Nestled on a picturesque campus in tiny Hanover, New Hampshire, the college has produced a long list of celebrated alumni – among them two Treasury secretaries (Timothy Geithner, ’83, and Henry Paulson Jr., ’68), a Labor secretary (Robert Reich, ’68) and a hefty sampling of the one percent (including the CEOs of GE, eBay and Freddie Mac, and the former chairman of the Carlyle Group). Many of these titans of industry are products of the fraternity culture: Billionaire hedge-fund manager Stephen Mandel, who chairs Dartmouth’s board of trustees, was a brother in Psi Upsilon, the oldest fraternity on campus. Jeffery Immelt, the CEO of GE, was a Phi Delt, as were a number of other prominent trustees, among them Morgan Stanley senior adviser R. Bradford Evans, billionaire oilman Trevor Rees-Jones and venture capitalist William W. Hank Paulson belonged to Lohse’s fraternity, Sigma Alpha Epsilon, or SAE.In response to Lohse’s op-ed, the Dartmouth community let loose a torrent of vitriol against him on The Dartmouth‘s website.

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Contents.Size you sure SAE has 300 chapters? Because then TKE should be revised as not having the most active chapters. My last look from my greek stats says 229 05:06, 27 March 2009 (UTC)Adding the flag This is a link to the flag: I have no idea on how to post it here, so I ask one of you to please add it. —Preceding comment added by 11:03, 18 February 2008 (UTC) Please Split There needs to be a new section for famous Alumni.Perhaps. Either way, why not add a 'Members of Sigma Alpha Epsilon' category to each of them? —Preceding comment added by 02:58, 1 July 2008 (UTC).

This list has now been split from the main article, and can be seen at. 10:24, 27 July 2009 (UTC)R. Dismer Bassett I have requested this article for comment.

Dismer Bassett is a name that is being consistently added to the famous alumni section by suspected sock puppets. Dismer Bassett is a non-notable and does not meet the criteria of Wikipedia's notability requirments. 00:35, 20 January 2006 (UTC)There is no 'famous alumni' section on this page. It is merely a list of SAE brothers.

Multiple SAE brothers have been added to this list and removed when they should not be. —Preceding comment added by 18:55, 22 April 2009 (UTC) removed POV sections I removed the 'To the SAE undergrad.' And 'True Gentleman' sections, I feel they violate. 03:45, 5 June 2006 (UTC)Why I am restoring NPOV & Advertisement Tag I am restoring the NPOV tag and Advertisement Tag because it is necessary. Since it was removed since I last put it up, I will now justify why I put it up in the hopes that anybody who removes it will justify its removal.The language on the History section seems to be boilerplate language produced by the Fraternity. While this might be a good guide to the frat's history, it is also deceptive to pretend it is neutral language that doesn't read like an advertisement.

It's like reading a Wikipedia page about Wal-mart prepared by Wal-Mart, or reading a Wikipedia page about a Congressman that was prepared by his/her staffers.Now, the 'True Gentleman' section. That perhaps would belong in a section of quotes about the Fraternity or by its founders or whoever the fellow is that said the quote. Its placement in the middle of the article only goes to show that this article was not prepared with the idea of making the entry befit an encyclopedia.

It also bolsters the argument that the entry reads like an advertisement.Until this article is changed to a more neutral presentation, or until somebody convinces me (through this talk page) that the existing page is neutral and not an advertisement, I will continue to restore this tag whenever it is deleted. 04:59, 13 November 2006 (UTC)takethemudAtleast now, you've explained why you put the tag in the first place. It is very difficult for other people when other editors place any sort of tag on an article without so much as an explanation (i.e. What specific part of the article that warranted the tag in the first place).

Having said that I do agree the history section is not written in a formal tone. 05:07, 13 November 2006 (UTC)The True Gentleman is a quote by a man that wasn't even an SAE at the time. John Walter Wayland submitted this quote to a Virginia paper in response to the question, What is a True Gentleman. This quote was then brought in as a guiding motto for SAE's because one of their original core values was that of a True Gentleman, that part of the historical and core values isnt one of opinion about the quote but that of fact because it is a part of SAE. John Walter Wayland went to Virginia Military Institute and was retrospectivly initiated by SAE when he was 70ish. — Preceding comment added by 14:08, 23 May 2012 (UTC) 'The True Gentleman' Section changes I added a history segment to the section about 'The True Gentleman.' I kept it as neutral as possible.

I think the problems with writing about SAE and maintaining neutrality is that the only history publications of the fraternity have been produced by the organization and therefore may sound biased. I understand your concern for the integrity of this website, so I am trying to help the situation. Being a brother of SAE myself, I would really like to see this page meet the quality standards of Wikipedia. Thanks.Problem Chapters what happened to this section?Answer: I felt that this section shined a negative light on the organization and therefore upset the neutrality of the article. Since there is a discussion on positive bias in the article, the same should go for negative bias as well.That doesn't make any sense.

'The same should go for negative bias as well'? If that's the case, then the negative bias should be in the article. Wikipedia is suppose to be neither for or against. Take a look at Pi Kappa Phi. The problem chapters should be reinstated considering that they were cited. 00:57, 11 June 2009 (UTC)its unfair to attempt to hide noteworthy events because they shine a negative light. Just because something is bad doesnt mean it violates NPOV.

Facts are Facts. It isnt about being Against, but rather about documenting events that can be cited 00:57, 11 June 2009 (UTC)Relax. I'm about to fix the history to remove the bias from it. You say that 'Wikipedia is supposed to be neither for or against.' With the problems chapters section and the history as it is, it makes the article for AND against.

Once the history has been fixed, then the article should be fine. The article should be merged here. Individual chapters should never have their own website. The same thing happened with chapters of Beta Theta Pi. All chapter articles which were created subsequently got deleted were merged to the main Beta Theta Pi page.

18:14, 27 February 2007 (UTC)I have proposed article for deletion in according with the above said. 22:17, 6 March 2007 (UTC) Carson Palmer Where did the information Carson Palmer is a member of SAE come from? I've looked in the fraternity's national membership directory and he doesn't come up. —The preceding comment was added by (. ) 20:38, 10 April 2007 (UTC). Haven't been able to find it either.

23:03, 22 April 2007 (UTC)I can't find it either, except for in a Wiki BLP on him, which states that he was in a 'Sigma Alpha' fraternity. Should the reference to him here be removed?

23:39, 18 January 2008 (UTC)Carson Palmer was an SAE at USC California Gamma Chapter. I know this, because I am currently in said chapter. We have composite pictures, paddles, etc.

The Phoenix Sae

Definitely true — Preceding comment added by 06:45, 3 May 2012 (UTC) Yes, but how does that fit in with and? — 15:26, 3 May 2012 (UTC) Phi Alpha Removed reference to the motto, which was necessary due to the fact that the meaning of said motto is a fraternity secret.

Please try to not reveal any more fraternity secrets in future postings.fraternity mottos are not generally secret, however, the underlying meanings may be 08:32, 20 April 2007 (UTC)Good work. The literal meaning is quite different than the secret meaning, but it should still not be published in either regard. 23:02, 22 April 2007 (UTC)I was surprised/shocked to surf through this site and find out all sorts of secret stuff.like the translation of Phi Alpha.

Glad to see it's gone. Member # 197971 OK MU —Preceding comment added by (. ) 18:29, 5 August 2008 (UTC) Why are your so called secrets off limits. If they exist, they are fair game 00:57, 11 June 2009 (UTC)I would have to say the secrets are not off limits. However, as a member of another fraternity, I would have to say over 99% of the 'meanings' posted online are incorrect anyway. If they are being removed it is probably because they are wrong. 19:45, 7 August 2009 (UTC)As a member of SAE I would say that while an argument could be made that there is no legal standing for preservation of secrecy, that the secret meaning of Phi Alpha and any other SAE ceremony or symbology that the organization chooses not to publicly divulge are the intellectual property of SAE and its members.

These members take an oath to preserve that secrecy and any publication of secret information on wikipedia would in fact be a violation of wiki terms of service as it would violate the intellectual property rights of SAE and its members. PA 254545 - 04:20, 27 August 2009 (UTC)References to Phi Gamma Delta The best way to handle this issue is to post many different meanings for phi alpha.I keep seeing one member post a reference to some of ΣAE's founders being associated with Phi Gamma Delta prior to forming ΣAE.